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Old 3rd February 2019, 07:34 AM   #444221  /  #76
Mantisdreamz
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^my mom uses that quite a lot

just searching, 'diclofenac liver' makes it look apprehensive, but I haven't looked at a lot of the articles.

She takes tylenol quite a bit as well. I have noticed that her tolerance in alcohol has really diminished.
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Old 3rd February 2019, 02:06 PM   #444230  /  #77
MondoVman
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"her tolerance in alcohol has really diminished"

So was mine 27 years ago when I was pulled over doing 57 mph in a 35 zone.
"Had I known it was to be my last, I'd a enjoyed it more" - famous last words.

To clarify, I was drunk, not on meds. Blew a 0.15 = gross intoxication.
My tolerance for the consequences of drinking had reached a new low.
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Last edited by MondoVman; 3rd February 2019 at 02:09 PM.
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Old 3rd February 2019, 03:17 PM   #444232  /  #78
gib
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testicular cyst cut out 4 days ago, do not recommend
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Old 3rd February 2019, 03:18 PM   #444233  /  #79
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Originally Posted by gib View Post
testicular cyst cut out 4 days ago, do not recommend
So you're saying let it stay in?
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Old 3rd February 2019, 04:55 PM   #444234  /  #80
gib
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good question, i guess i'm on the fence except being on a fence would be unbearable right now
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Old 3rd February 2019, 06:46 PM   #444236  /  #81
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Ow, gib! Sounds uncomfortable and anxiety inducing.

So... not taking up cycling the countryside any day soon?
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Old 3rd February 2019, 06:49 PM   #444237  /  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantisdreamz View Post
^my mom uses that quite a lot

just searching, 'diclofenac liver' makes it look apprehensive, but I haven't looked at a lot of the articles.

She takes tylenol quite a bit as well. I have noticed that her tolerance in alcohol has really diminished.
There is an oral version of diclofenac. And it looks like the method of intake does change the chance of liver injury pretty dramatically.

https://livertox.nih.gov/Diclofenac.htm

Quote:
Hepatotoxicity
Elevated serum aminotransferase levels have been reported in up to 15% of patients taking oral diclofenac chronically, but are greater than 3 times the upper limit of normal in only 2% to 4% (Cases 1 and 2). Clinically apparent and symptomatic liver disease with jaundice due to diclofenac is rare (1 to 5 cases per 100,000 prescriptions, occurring in 1 to 5 persons per 10,000 exposed). Nevertheless, more than a hundred instances of clinically apparent liver injury due to diclofenac have been reported in the literature and, in most case series, diclofenac ranks in the top 10 causes of drug induced liver injury. The time to onset of liver injury varies from within a week to over a year after starting. The majority of cases present within 2 to 6 months (Cases 3 and 4), and the more severe cases tend to present earlier. The pattern of injury is almost exclusively hepatocellular, although cases presenting with mixed patterns have been reported. The clinical picture is that of jaundice preceded by anorexia, nausea, vomiting and malaise. Fever and rash occur in 25% of cases and some cases have immunoallergic features, while others resemble chronic hepatitis and have autoimmune features. In most cases, liver histology reveals an acute lobular hepatitis. However, a cases with prolonged latency diclofenac hepatotoxicity can have clinical and histologic features of chronic hepatitis (Case 2). There seems to be greater susceptibility for diclofenac liver injury among women than men. The injury can be severe, and several cases of acute liver failure have been attributed to diclofenac.

Likelihood score: A (well known cause of clinically apparent liver injury).

Topical forms of diclofenac (solutions, gels, creams, patches) have been associated with only a low rate of serum enzyme elevations (generally less than 1%) that may be no greater than occurs with placebo or vehicle application. However, product labels for topical diclofenac mention the possibility of liver injury and at least one case of clinically apparent liver injury attributed to topical diclofenac has been reported in the literature. Nevertheless, clinically apparent liver injury due to topical forms of diclofenac must be exceedingly rare.
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Old 3rd February 2019, 06:52 PM   #444238  /  #83
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Yow, gib. I hope the recovery process is swift and complete. :/
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Old 3rd February 2019, 08:07 PM   #444239  /  #84
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Are you taking time of work, gib? Standing for long periods must be pretty uncomfortable.
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Old 4th February 2019, 12:25 AM   #444257  /  #85
Mantisdreamz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MondoVman View Post
"her tolerance in alcohol has really diminished"

So was mine 27 years ago when I was pulled over doing 57 mph in a 35 zone.
"Had I known it was to be my last, I'd a enjoyed it more" - famous last words.

To clarify, I was drunk, not on meds. Blew a 0.15 = gross intoxication.
My tolerance for the consequences of drinking had reached a new low.
damn
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Old 4th February 2019, 12:29 AM   #444258  /  #86
Mantisdreamz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oblivion View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantisdreamz View Post
^my mom uses that quite a lot

just searching, 'diclofenac liver' makes it look apprehensive, but I haven't looked at a lot of the articles.

She takes tylenol quite a bit as well. I have noticed that her tolerance in alcohol has really diminished.
There is an oral version of diclofenac. And it looks like the method of intake does change the chance of liver injury pretty dramatically.

https://livertox.nih.gov/Diclofenac.htm

Quote:
Hepatotoxicity
Elevated serum aminotransferase levels have been reported in up to 15% of patients taking oral diclofenac chronically, but are greater than 3 times the upper limit of normal in only 2% to 4% (Cases 1 and 2). Clinically apparent and symptomatic liver disease with jaundice due to diclofenac is rare (1 to 5 cases per 100,000 prescriptions, occurring in 1 to 5 persons per 10,000 exposed). Nevertheless, more than a hundred instances of clinically apparent liver injury due to diclofenac have been reported in the literature and, in most case series, diclofenac ranks in the top 10 causes of drug induced liver injury. The time to onset of liver injury varies from within a week to over a year after starting. The majority of cases present within 2 to 6 months (Cases 3 and 4), and the more severe cases tend to present earlier. The pattern of injury is almost exclusively hepatocellular, although cases presenting with mixed patterns have been reported. The clinical picture is that of jaundice preceded by anorexia, nausea, vomiting and malaise. Fever and rash occur in 25% of cases and some cases have immunoallergic features, while others resemble chronic hepatitis and have autoimmune features. In most cases, liver histology reveals an acute lobular hepatitis. However, a cases with prolonged latency diclofenac hepatotoxicity can have clinical and histologic features of chronic hepatitis (Case 2). There seems to be greater susceptibility for diclofenac liver injury among women than men. The injury can be severe, and several cases of acute liver failure have been attributed to diclofenac.

Likelihood score: A (well known cause of clinically apparent liver injury).

Topical forms of diclofenac (solutions, gels, creams, patches) have been associated with only a low rate of serum enzyme elevations (generally less than 1%) that may be no greater than occurs with placebo or vehicle application. However, product labels for topical diclofenac mention the possibility of liver injury and at least one case of clinically apparent liver injury attributed to topical diclofenac has been reported in the literature. Nevertheless, clinically apparent liver injury due to topical forms of diclofenac must be exceedingly rare.
I wonder why there is such a difference. I know that my mom uses the gel.


I think the Tylenol affects her liver a lot, though.
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Old 4th February 2019, 06:05 AM   #444271  /  #87
oblivion
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I suspect the difference is because the gel doesn't go through the digestive system. The liver processes the nutrients that are absorbed in the small intestine. It does a lot of other stuff, but that's the main liver function that would encounter oral diclofenac.
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Old 4th February 2019, 06:38 AM   #444272  /  #88
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whereas, the gel would just absorb into the skin, then blood vessels...maybe the liver processes it at a lower rate, and has the fatty skin as a shield.
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Old 4th February 2019, 08:09 AM   #444276  /  #89
gib
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Facetious View Post
Are you taking time of work, gib? Standing for long periods must be pretty uncomfortable.

i had the day of the op off, and thursday and friday


but we can't afford to pay for more staff hours at this time of year so now i'm paying back the hours i borrowed from my sis


yes it is uncomfortable but i did check yesterday that everything still works
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Old 11th April 2019, 06:03 AM   #446773  /  #90
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Finally...






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Old 12th April 2019, 02:31 AM   #446799  /  #91
borealis
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That was pretty cool.
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