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Old 7th October 2018, 03:10 AM   #438398  /  #126
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Old 7th October 2018, 07:20 AM   #438400  /  #127
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It has been one of the few ways indigenous peoples of Australia have been able to get out of their ghettos.

yeah, here too for people of color, but is that really saying something about the value of professional sport, or about how crappy our societies integrate and assimilate and provide opportunity? There is also the argument that professional sports supports varying degrees and types of exploitation, and damages far more people who work hard trying to become professional athletes and fail than the few that do become successful, but only successful for a few years while they are young and uninjured.



http://time.com/3586037/exploitation...ge-basketball



https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/....1002/mde.2793


https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov...r_mrkt_cea.pdf
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Old 7th October 2018, 09:08 PM   #438409  /  #128
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Originally Posted by Majiffy View Post
Sports are fucking dumb anyway we should just stop taking them seriously

It started as a way to show military might and that doesn't fucking matter anymore
Sport is hated by most fatties and the inactive corps. It's easy to dismiss their 'why'.

That is where I was a few years ago.

Having started running, I've tried to understand, appreciate and respect the competition. My coach is a national champ (just waiting to find out how she did in Victoria) and her husband is also a national champ.

When I hear people venting hate at them I get it. I was running with an olympian (shameless brag) and told him that I thought the olympics was one of the worst things that could happen to a top-level athlete.

I am still pretty disgusted with the Olympics. I don't expect that will change for me, but I am gaining a lot more respect for olympians. Partly because I've talked to a few, and tried to use empathy.

As to the high end of competition, I do think it's good (also inevitible) in a lot of ways. The top-level runners I see, certainly do smash each other in competition, but you will see them sharing a drink after as well. It isn't 'stupid' to try to be the best.

It isn't stupid to lose to your competition, and still have a nice time.

Sports are fucking dumb. They are also a great place to practice some really great skills which can lead to a better life. Would you deny a child the social practice they might get from sports joy, disappointment and teamwork? I have a hobby which improves my cardio, joint and muscle strength. My other hobby (posting here) does, one might say, less for me. At least less tangible. Sport is dumb, but a lot of what it yields is clearly worthwhile.
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Old 7th October 2018, 09:28 PM   #438411  /  #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Majiffy View Post
Sports are fucking dumb anyway we should just stop taking them seriously

It started as a way to show military might and that doesn't fucking matter anymore
Sport is hated by most fatties and the inactive corps. It's easy to dismiss their 'why'.

That is where I was a few years ago.

Having started running, I've tried to understand, appreciate and respect the competition. My coach is a national champ (just waiting to find out how she did in Victoria) and her husband is also a national champ.

When I hear people venting hate at them I get it. I was running with an olympian (shameless brag) and told him that I thought the olympics was one of the worst things that could happen to a top-level athlete.

I am still pretty disgusted with the Olympics. I don't expect that will change for me, but I am gaining a lot more respect for olympians. Partly because I've talked to a few, and tried to use empathy.

As to the high end of competition, I do think it's good (also inevitible) in a lot of ways. The top-level runners I see, certainly do smash each other in competition, but you will see them sharing a drink after as well. It isn't 'stupid' to try to be the best.

It isn't stupid to lose to your competition, and still have a nice time.

Sports are fucking dumb. They are also a great place to practice some really great skills which can lead to a better life. Would you deny a child the social practice they might get from sports joy, disappointment and teamwork? I have a hobby which improves my cardio, joint and muscle strength. My other hobby (posting here) does, one might say, less for me. At least less tangible. Sport is dumb, but a lot of what it yields is clearly worthwhile.

Professional sports are stupid. Everyone should play games, physical or mental. It's not the competition that I have a problem with, it's the commercialism, the exploitation, and the artificial "identification" with teams that creates a form of tribalism that is completely useless. Imagine instead if people took elections as seriously as they took professional sports, and instead of identifying with commercial teams, they actually identified with their election district!
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Old 7th October 2018, 09:44 PM   #438412  /  #130
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Originally Posted by Zeluvia View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunt View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majiffy View Post
Sports are fucking dumb anyway we should just stop taking them seriously

It started as a way to show military might and that doesn't fucking matter anymore
Sport is hated by most fatties and the inactive corps. It's easy to dismiss their 'why'.

That is where I was a few years ago.

Having started running, I've tried to understand, appreciate and respect the competition. My coach is a national champ (just waiting to find out how she did in Victoria) and her husband is also a national champ.

When I hear people venting hate at them I get it. I was running with an olympian (shameless brag) and told him that I thought the olympics was one of the worst things that could happen to a top-level athlete.

I am still pretty disgusted with the Olympics. I don't expect that will change for me, but I am gaining a lot more respect for olympians. Partly because I've talked to a few, and tried to use empathy.

As to the high end of competition, I do think it's good (also inevitible) in a lot of ways. The top-level runners I see, certainly do smash each other in competition, but you will see them sharing a drink after as well. It isn't 'stupid' to try to be the best.

It isn't stupid to lose to your competition, and still have a nice time.

Sports are fucking dumb. They are also a great place to practice some really great skills which can lead to a better life. Would you deny a child the social practice they might get from sports joy, disappointment and teamwork? I have a hobby which improves my cardio, joint and muscle strength. My other hobby (posting here) does, one might say, less for me. At least less tangible. Sport is dumb, but a lot of what it yields is clearly worthwhile.

Professional sports are stupid. Everyone should play games, physical or mental. It's not the competition that I have a problem with, it's the commercialism, the exploitation, and the artificial "identification" with teams that creates a form of tribalism that is completely useless. Imagine instead if people took elections as seriously as they took professional sports, and instead of identifying with commercial teams, they actually identified with their election district!
That sounds beautiful and terrifying, at the same time.

I think pro sport is business (so as good or bad as any business) but where else can the high-level competition be found right now?

Something exciting is happening in running, at least, with athletes being on strava and other platforms. A segment can stand near your house, and everyone who runs by can compete, when they want, and compare if they want. This allows a level of participation in that sport that a business previously couldn't provide.

You could make a 1km segment between you and your parents place, and race yourself every time you walk over. You could use the same segment to run your fastest ever kilometer against anyone else in the world (who will run by)

I think a decentralization is coming to sport, which will drastically improve things. Even at the elite level.
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Old 8th October 2018, 08:09 AM   #438420  /  #131
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Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Southwest Atlantica
Still bitching about sports?

Substitute acting or modeling in the horseshit you've posted.

People gamble, seek fame, seek the easy route, seek fame/fortune, whatever.
No one has to participate in sports.

What a pussy you are, Z, for bitching about sports - childhood or adult.

My first sports team was Little League Baseball at age 6. I learned a great activity
as well as sportsmanship, which later translated into getting along better with
peers whether winning or losing.

The Real World is so much more rich, complex and nuanced in good motives
than bad, thank God.
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Old 8th October 2018, 02:19 PM   #438439  /  #132
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Originally Posted by MondoVman View Post
Still bitching about sports?

Substitute acting or modeling in the horseshit you've posted.

People gamble, seek fame, seek the easy route, seek fame/fortune, whatever.
No one has to participate in sports.

What a pussy you are, Z, for bitching about sports - childhood or adult.

My first sports team was Little League Baseball at age 6. I learned a great activity
as well as sportsmanship, which later translated into getting along better with
peers whether winning or losing.

The Real World is so much more rich, complex and nuanced in good motives
than bad, thank God.

Did you even read what I posted or comprehend it? Read it again. I have nothing against Little League Baseball for kids. Or local unprofessional baseball and softball teams.



I do have something against the pressure that is put on kids to perform by parents who dream of having the next professional baseball player.


Games are supposed to be FUN and do exactly what they did for you.
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Old 9th October 2018, 03:55 AM   #438451  /  #133
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Ya, ok, I did not ever so carefully screen your screed against professional sports.

You are still full of shit for claiming pro sports have no right to exist.
Idiot parents and delusional man-children dream of getting rich in pro sports.
Exactly the same as Americans' freedom to act, model, and take their clothes off
for money - all their time in the spotlight is severely limited, well perhaps not actors,
but actors on average have very short-lived careers.

Sports will be around for centuries to come, though perhaps society will eliminate
the most violent - boxing, MMA, U.S. football. Then again, we have extreme sports
of snow-this-and-that, near-space freefalls ... all of which can be monetized.

To repeat, idiot parents and their offspring get what they deserve.
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Old 9th October 2018, 02:33 PM   #438458  /  #134
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Ya, ok, I did not ever so carefully screen your screed against professional sports.

You are still full of shit for claiming pro sports have no right to exist.
Idiot parents and delusional man-children dream of getting rich in pro sports.
Exactly the same as Americans' freedom to act, model, and take their clothes off
for money - all their time in the spotlight is severely limited, well perhaps not actors,
but actors on average have very short-lived careers.

Sports will be around for centuries to come, though perhaps society will eliminate
the most violent - boxing, MMA, U.S. football. Then again, we have extreme sports
of snow-this-and-that, near-space freefalls ... all of which can be monetized.

To repeat, idiot parents and their offspring get what they deserve.

I didn't say a fucking thing about Rights or existence. People have the right to behave like stupid instinct driven animals at all times.
I have the right to say they are stupid. Can you even have a discussion without creating strawmen to batter your head against?

Back when you were a kid playing little league, how many of the parents were dreaming of a professional ball player? Those aren't kids dreams now, they are parents dreams, and the fact that they have become the dreams of parents speaks to lessening of opportunity in societies as a whole.


I think that is a function of population growth, not necessarily any specific system.
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Old 9th October 2018, 02:35 PM   #438459  /  #135
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Why do you hate freedom zuzu
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Old 9th October 2018, 02:39 PM   #438460  /  #136
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Why do you hate freedom zuzu

You can be free and poor or free and wealthy, both work fine for me : )
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Old 9th October 2018, 04:20 PM   #438465  /  #137
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Sports are fun and I enjoy both watching them and playing them. And, honestly, praticing enough to be as impressive as high level players takes a lot of time and they deserve to be able to eat!! So they should totally be paid to do sports.

But also I'm a commie and think everyone should get paid a living wage regardless of what they are or are not doing! And also we should eat the rich. (not really because of prion diseases, but we should definitely compost them to grow our crops)
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Old 9th October 2018, 06:07 PM   #438468  /  #138
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Why do you hate freedom zuzu

You can be free and poor or free and wealthy, both work fine for me : )
With a simple example like running, it shows you will find that it is impossible to avoid elite competition.

See, a runner who enjoys running the fastest, will continue to find faster competitors until they stop liking it.

Spectators will keep chucking money into a hat to bring the best competitors together.

It isn't stupid, it is simply a meritocracy in action - including the unfairness you (and I) dislike.

I am trying to learn competition and it's benefits, while coming from the place you seem to, Zeluvia. I suggest competing at something - getting DAMNED good at it - before reviewing your opinion in it. Or you risk sounding like you are just expressing sour grapes.

I am not competing well at running, but I've still learned a lot about sport - changed my mind about sport and competition - than I thought I could.

I suggest powerlifting. All you need to do is learn the proper form, and lift carefully. The improvement will come, even if you train like a careful nana.
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Old 9th October 2018, 11:26 PM   #438469  /  #139
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Quote:
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Quote:
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Why do you hate freedom zuzu

You can be free and poor or free and wealthy, both work fine for me : )
With a simple example like running, it shows you will find that it is impossible to avoid elite competition.

See, a runner who enjoys running the fastest, will continue to find faster competitors until they stop liking it.

Spectators will keep chucking money into a hat to bring the best competitors together.

It isn't stupid, it is simply a meritocracy in action - including the unfairness you (and I) dislike.

I am trying to learn competition and it's benefits, while coming from the place you seem to, Zeluvia. I suggest competing at something - getting DAMNED good at it - before reviewing your opinion in it. Or you risk sounding like you are just expressing sour grapes.

I am not competing well at running, but I've still learned a lot about sport - changed my mind about sport and competition - than I thought I could.

I suggest powerlifting. All you need to do is learn the proper form, and lift carefully. The improvement will come, even if you train like a careful nana.

I play a lot of games cunt. I like competition, I like winning, but I also want it to be fun.


You can keep going and working on your skills and one day you wake up and it's not fun anymore, it's anxiety producing low reward work. The feeling of winning no longer makes up for the stress investment it took you to get there. The fun is gone.



I see professional sports like that. I know some people still find it fun, and most professional athletes have such short careers they don't lose the fun.
I still don't like professional sports, because I think the profit motive is anti-fun.



Maybe you don't remember that the Olympics used to not allow professional athletes?


http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/22/opinio...urs/index.html
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Old 9th October 2018, 11:54 PM   #438471  /  #140
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Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Circum-polar region
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I play a lot of games cunt. I like competition, I like winning, but I also want it to be fun.
So we begin with agreement. I like that, though I am just learning now to enjoy competition.

Any asshole can enjoy a win, but to enjoy losing, I think you need to have a bit more depth to your personality. At least that is what I am learning about myself.


Quote:
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You can keep going and working on your skills and one day you wake up and it's not fun anymore, it's anxiety producing low reward work.
Yup. I quickly stopped seeking speed (the easiest measure of running improvement) and moved to endurance.

That's a shit one, too, after awhile.

I also watch heartbeats per kilometer (I can get under 1 beat per meter regualarly). If I improve that, it seems to be a measure of heart health and running economy.

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The feeling of winning no longer makes up for the stress investment it took you to get there. The fun is gone.
For you, maybe. For runners like Ed Whitlock, it serves them into their dotage.
(he set age group records into his seventh decade)
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I see professional sports like that. I know some people still find it fun, and most professional athletes have such short careers they don't lose the fun.
I still don't like professional sports, because I think the profit motive is anti-fun.
Money ruins fitness in several ways. Last time I was running with an Olympic athlete, I said that the Olympics were the worst thing that could happen to a great athlete. He understood, and I hope he still wins his competitions.

In addition to having a shitty job meeting Olympic demands, he spends an awful lot of time trying to inspire young kids to activity.

Good work, and it wouldn't be as effective without his celebrity status.
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Maybe you don't remember that the Olympics used to not allow professional athletes?
The Olympics are not about sport, but about business.

Where did it go wrong? I don't know, but I think it's a problem with scale, rather than a problem with sport.

So the pro's are shit, but that doesn't mean that excellence is.

Since excellence is best shown by showmen, I guess we have to accept that showmen are part of sport.

I don't like it, but I don't see another way.

I mean, there are many ways to achieve mediocrity, but for excellence, I think the show comes along with it.
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http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/22/opinio...urs/index.html
Didn't look at your link, because I don't think we disagree here.

You might discover that we agree on a lot, even if I do reach different conclusions.
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