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View Poll Results: Is whoring ethically defensible?
Yes 3 75.00%
No 1 25.00%
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Voters: 4. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19th July 2018, 07:27 PM   #434490  /  #101
Carlsson
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Originally Posted by MSG View Post
Reminder that this is a C-man that and it and he should be ignored

no onw asked you so fuck off
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Old 19th July 2018, 08:37 PM   #434491  /  #102
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Originally Posted by Cunt View Post
I'm glad the smart people don't pay much attention to you.
Wait: We have smart people here? Why didn't anyone tell me?
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Old 19th July 2018, 09:36 PM   #434492  /  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSG View Post
Reminder that this is a C-man that and it and he should be ignored

no onw asked you so fuck off
I think it's instructive how MSG has been so 'gentled' that he can't even type out my name

It makes me feel pretty good about every 'barb' he flings in this manner. It's like a self-embarrassing robot, programmed by Ned Flanders, is trolling me.

C-diddly-doo!
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Old Yesterday, 05:30 AM   #434561  /  #104
Zeluvia
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Originally Posted by Cunt View Post
If either side of the exchange is unlawful, it would seem to me to make things operate underground.

The reason illegal immigrants have so much of my sympathy is because of their inability to interact with the justice system. At least interact with it without fear.

If we want to treat both parties respectably, we have to (I think) find a way to convince folks to invest in a bordello. At the moment, I wouldn't do it because of how sure I am that I would be investing in a misery-generating business. Others have their own reasons, but until most people can see it as a 'clean investment', we are missing something important.

I will invest in the bordello of the three women who sued the Canadian government and got half their "Nordic" model laws thrown out. = )


Face, I think you see all prostitutes as victims, who need protection. I don't see it that way. Of course, those Asian girls giving Hand jobs in Massage parlors are victims, maybe, I haven't been able to ask one. Surely by now they know what happens when you answer one of those ads, we have deported enough of them. But they are also illegal immigrants. And the people that brought them in the country did it illegaly.

There are plenty of laws to prosecute people for human trafficking. And human trafficking is not just about sex. It's also about picking peanuts, and onions.


And I am think competition from LEGAL bordellos and massage parlours would have more effect on the illegal ones, especially if they start reporting on each other for undercutting prices with illegal labor.


We could also fix demand by castrating the majority of men. Now that works for me : )
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Old Yesterday, 05:39 AM   #434564  /  #105
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I will invest in the bordello of the three women who sued the Canadian government and got half their "Nordic" model laws thrown out. = )
Was this the group who initially (3-5 years ago) took the route to the Supreme Court to get the thing overturned? Or something fresher?
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Old Yesterday, 05:41 AM   #434566  /  #106
Zeluvia
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yeah it was them
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Old Yesterday, 05:46 AM   #434568  /  #107
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Originally Posted by Zeluvia View Post
yeah it was them
They seemed to navigate from a position of strength, and love of their work. Might have been just media spin, but I am inclined to believe them.

Still don't know if I would invest though...have to see how they care for employees and navigate some HR issues...it's a good 'test case' for me to think about a bordello as it intersects with HR issues...challenging.
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Old Yesterday, 08:29 AM   #434576  /  #108
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http://www.scarletalliance.org.au/laws/qld
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Old Yesterday, 08:35 AM   #434577  /  #109
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https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/nat...18-gs5649.html
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Old Yesterday, 08:42 AM   #434578  /  #110
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Read my posts with the following stupid accent: IN MY HEAD (MOSTLY)
I am not bright eyed and bushy tailed.
There are still drug addicts feeding their habit.
There is still a slave sex trade.
But there is now more protect and some few, maybe lucky few, who get uni degree without a 100,000 hex debt or who buy a house.
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Old Yesterday, 02:07 PM   #434587  /  #111
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Yeah but you can see in those laws how they still have to make it hard to be legal.



Can't hire a driver. ...pfft...
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Old Yesterday, 04:29 PM   #434595  /  #112
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I just had a glance, and you can't hire two sex workers...or it is illegal.

So I wonder if any of those restrictions prevent anything? Or if they are just there to try to appease both sides...

Prostitutes should be allowed to define their professional guidelines. It makes sense, it is the way we manage surveyors, engineers, doctors and lawyers.

So how many of those law-makers are self-declared whores? If the answer is 'none', I think I can guess where the problem is...
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Old Yesterday, 07:05 PM   #434601  /  #113
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Originally Posted by Cunt View Post
If either side of the exchange is unlawful, it would seem to me to make things operate underground.
If a punter can find a prostituted woman than I'd hazard a guess that the police can too.
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Old Yesterday, 07:53 PM   #434603  /  #114
Facetious
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Originally Posted by Zeluvia View Post



In short, feminists pushed for a law to punish men, they got it, and it made things worse for prostitutes, because no one bothered to ask them first.
That's interesting. I'd heard the Swedism model was formulated after a group of researchers spent years talking to prostitutes about their experiences of prostitution.


“We spent several years doing fieldwork and we developed close relationships with the prostituted women. We heard about their experiences of past abuse, extreme poverty and violence. We were prepared for these stories, because of our previous studies on outcasts and marginalized people. But what the women told us of their concrete experiences of prostitution was unexpected and shocking.''


Cecilie Høigård

Quote:
You haven't convinced me that the supposed increase in "trafficking" isn't from business people moving from an area where something is illegal to an area where it is legal. That would just be common sense that would happen.
You sound like you're trying to convince yourself tbh. Trafficking is that nasty little fly in the ointment which spoils your picture of this beautiful legalised prostitution utopia.

Quote:
BTW, Is it trafficking when a coyote brings people that pay him over the border even though he has no intention of getting them a job or exploiting their labor in any way?
No because human trafficking is very specific in that it's moving people from one country to another in order to force them in to servitude, usually sex slavery but sometimes forced labour. I don't know what your particular example of illegal people movement is called, I thought it was people smuggling but apparently that's a synonym for trafficking.
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Old Yesterday, 08:45 PM   #434604  /  #115
Facetious
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Originally Posted by Zeluvia View Post
Face, I think you see all prostitutes as victims, who need protection;
They are at constant risk of rape and extreme physical violence. I would say it goes without saying that they need protetcion.

Quote:
And I am think competition from LEGAL bordellos and massage parlours would have more effect on the illegal ones, especially if they start reporting on each other for undercutting prices with illegal labor.
Such faith you have in the free market. Trickle down theory didn't work, and de-regulation lead to a race to the bottom and an erosion of workers rights and wages, plus an increase in illegal practices caused by the lack of government oversight. But mysteriously when it comes to the legalisation of prostitution, suddenly neo-liberalism makes perfect sense and the freemarket will reward the virtuous while making sure the unvirtuous fail.

Quote:
We could also fix demand by castrating the majority of men. Now that works for me : )
Why? The majority of men don't use prostitutes. I like to think this is because the majority of men don't find the thought of sex with an unwilling woman appealing.
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Old Yesterday, 10:19 PM   #434605  /  #116
Cunt
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Originally Posted by Facetious View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunt View Post
If either side of the exchange is unlawful, it would seem to me to make things operate underground.
If a punter can find a prostituted woman than I'd hazard a guess that the police can too.
I'm not sure what a 'punter' is, nor what relevance it has to my statement.

Making it unlawful pushes the activity underground. I personally think it functions more ethically when it is overseen by business practices and professional codes-of-conduct, rather than mob rule.
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Originally Posted by Facetious View Post
Why? The majority of men don't use prostitutes. I like to think this is because the majority of men don't find the thought of sex with an unwilling woman appealing.
Your whole viewpoint ignores the fact that people may choose to offer sex for valuable considerations (such as money) WILLINGLY. Some even report having great joy in the work.

Forget criminals for a moment, what about the lawful exchange of blowjobs, handies and ass-to-mouth? Do you have a problem with those?

Are you suggesting that people are welcome to give those things away, but not to rent them?

Why limit sexual activity so ferociously around money? Your conservative view of sex is kind of at odds with most people. I don't even understand what it is you are against...is it sex? Sex as coercion? Exploiting sex?

Fucking is legal. Selling is legal. Why isn't selling fucking legal?
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Old Yesterday, 11:19 PM   #434610  /  #117
Facetious
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punter = John

Would you sell sexual access to your own body?
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Old Today, 12:17 AM   #434611  /  #118
Cunt
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Originally Posted by Facetious View Post
punter = John

Would you sell sexual access to your own body?
Sure. So would you, I would wager. Especially since we have defined 'sexual access' as poorly as we have defined 'sell'.

Shall we have a go at defining some of those?
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Old Today, 02:01 AM   #434629  /  #119
Zeluvia
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Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Evil Duckess
Face, quote isn't working so..


Can you source your quote from the Swede? That could have been from original law. Because I think when they first legalized prostitution, they did a ton of research. But what is now referred to as the "Nordic" model is actually the result of the law being changed in 1999 to make BUYING sex illegal.


Also, the reason I asked about your definition of Human Trafficking is because San Antonio is a "hub" of human trafficking, so I decided to check the stats. And yes, they count all illegal immigrants who pay someone to help them get here as "trafficked" humans. If my next door neighbor helps her son get across the border illegally for her birthday, and she is caught, it would be counted as Human trafficking.



In other words, they count any illegal immigration assist as Human Trafficking.


Not sure if they count making fake documents, I don't think so.



Also, it doesn't matter if YOU would do it. Or if anyone on the forum would do it.

That is pretty authoritarian of you no?


I wouldn't bungee jump. Or sky dive.
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