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#292211 / #1 |
bad case of gleeks
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: a peninsula in the North Atlantic
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shenanigans with "belief"
There’s a pretty substantial subset of atheists among whom some really weird things are done with the idea of “belief”. I’ve gotten into this on TR on several occasions now.
One of the symptoms is the claim (apparently made seriously) to have no beliefs at all! If I ask the obvious question (“Do you really believe that you have no beliefs?”), they don’t seem to get the point. It’s weird. Another symptom: When discussing cases where I would say it’s awfully hard NOT to believe in something – e.g. my belief that I am sitting in a chair right now – these people will say things like “but when something is tangible, you don’t NEED to believe in it”. I’ve seen this invocation of “need” on several occasions, from several people. But what does (this kind of) “need” have to do with whether you DO believe or not? My best guess as to what’s going on (based on further prodding of such people) is that they’re restricting the meaning of “belief”, to apply only to “irrational belief”, or “insufficiently supported belief”, or something roughly along those lines. And if that’s what they’re doing, then that has other problems. For one thing, I think I have common usage on my side (with “belief” being much broader in application than these atheists want it to be). I’m not 100% against rebelling against common usage, but this particular rebellion doesn’t serve any useful purpose, IMO. They’re just making communication more difficult. And even with that restriction, the claim to have no beliefs is still silly. This rubbish strikes me as too stupid to have been invented multiple times independently. So here’s what I’m wondering: Does anyone know where this kind of thing started? Is there (for example) some Gnu Atheist Guru who wrote something like that in a book somewhere? eta in b4 who cares
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hipsters? ha. I was into claiming to have been into something before it was cool, before it was cool. |
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#292217 / #2 |
them days are gone, boy
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: the thin one out of Laurel & Hardy
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I believe that everyone has irrational beliefs.
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communicating my inner something since 2017 |
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015), Diogenes (1st October 2015) |
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#292220 / #3 | |
poikilothermic
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Canada
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It is annoying. I think it stems from there being a casual use for the word 'belief' (I believe the sun will rise tomorrow) and a formal use of the word, implying theism, and perhaps a third use, say foretelling weather because of folk beliefs.
Early on, theists made arguments like 'I can't see air but I believe it's there', which were silly irt theistic beliefs. I think that's where atheists began to be frustrated with such uses of the word. Hence: Quote:
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015) |
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#292223 / #4 |
kitchen sink garbage disposal
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Sweden
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this is above my head
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Yay from | Catavenger (15th November 2015), Majiffy (2nd October 2015) |
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#292226 / #5 |
Life is just a bowl of cherries
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Pleasant Living
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Basically it is common for atheists to abuse language, logic, rational thought, and the scientific method to support their absurd belief system.
They twist all of the above out of any semblance of reality because if used properly they would have to accept how wrong they are. Instead they prefer the no rules way of life. It is a rare atheist that is not a selfish prick with morals that change based upon how the circumstance fits their current desires.
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The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience. -Albert Camus |
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#292231 / #7 |
normal boring cunty type of woman
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: it's grim up north
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trust Jerome to shit up the thread 4 posts in
However, he does hit upon something that is true though not confined to atheists, it is common for people to create their own definitions for words for various different reasons. |
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015), Majiffy (2nd October 2015) |
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#292244 / #9 | |
Send Cash or Drugs
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Evil Duckess
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Quote:
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015) |
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#292251 / #10 |
too boring to be considered weird
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shenanigans with "belief"
I think atheists are referring to weird (to some) religious belief plus belief that gib is not lizard people. I.e. unprovable ones.
I agree with Zel; it gets old to keep hammering at that. (Forums that are broader than that suit me better. 'Nuff said.) ETA You go, Jerome! Wow you know loads of stuff!
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I thought I was in a bad mood but it's been a few years so I think this is who I am now |
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015) |
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#292257 / #11 |
poikilothermic
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Canada
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The parish I play music for is currently between priests and an interim priest(-ess: though the Anglicans seem to have a tough time wrapping their lips around the word 'priestess
![]() I may, if the opportunity arises, ask her a couple belief related questions with reference to Bro D's OP. ![]()
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (1st October 2015), Majiffy (2nd October 2015) |
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#292261 / #12 |
bad case of gleeks
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: a peninsula in the North Atlantic
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A different belief-related shenanigan:
One correspondent of mine (a theist, this time) tried to redefine "belief" in such a way that it wasn't about a mental state. "To believe X", he suggested, "means to act as if X is true." But that definition doesn't work either, as it presupposes that the truth of the matter (X versus ~X), as opposed to one's mental model, is what governs your actions. The only sense I can make out of this one is if he was trying to say something like "...to act as if you ______ that X is true" -- where some verb goes into the blank. The best verb to fit the concept being referenced is "believe", but that's the word that he's trying to (re)define. So in that case his definition would be circular, hence useless. I don't know how common this is, but anyway it's pretty dumb.
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hipsters? ha. I was into claiming to have been into something before it was cool, before it was cool. |
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#292265 / #13 |
bad case of gleeks
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: a peninsula in the North Atlantic
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On yet another different note: A lot of people treat belief as a matter of choice.
It seems to me that a chosen belief is (necessarily) a dishonest one. And that beliefs usually aren't chosen anyway.
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hipsters? ha. I was into claiming to have been into something before it was cool, before it was cool. |
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#292290 / #16 |
Ol' Zipperlaig
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Nøyfb
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science requires a load of belief; even faith, that the data produced by others is correct. how many people have ever seen the stratigraphic context of the Burgess Shale, let alone dated something via the uranium series, or repeated the Michelson-Morley experiment?
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#292308 / #18 |
bad case of gleeks
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: a peninsula in the North Atlantic
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Why do I get the feeling that you're setting an aspie trap?
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hipsters? ha. I was into claiming to have been into something before it was cool, before it was cool. |
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#292312 / #19 |
Ol' Zipperlaig
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Nøyfb
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I wouldn't do that to you bro d
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Yay from | Brother Daniel (2nd October 2015), Majiffy (2nd October 2015) |
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#292315 / #20 | |
Send Cash or Drugs
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Evil Duckess
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Quote:
I don't know if this preceded my atheism or not. I have been one for a very long time. I didn't read Hitchens or Dawkins et al cause they are babies compared to me : )
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#292316 / #21 | |
Send Cash or Drugs
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Evil Duckess
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Quote:
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#292359 / #23 |
I'll have you know I'm popular on many web forums
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Buffalo, NY
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Herpy derpy jerfy! ![]() ʘᴥʘ pledged my daily allegiance to Satan and pear-shaped air hockey turntable earth Vivere diu rebellionus! Proud propagator of the "fire for warmth" myth |
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#292361 / #24 | |
I'll have you know I'm popular on many web forums
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Buffalo, NY
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Quote:
I usually just gel my hair vertically and then drive around the neighborhood really fast.
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Herpy derpy jerfy! ![]() ʘᴥʘ pledged my daily allegiance to Satan and pear-shaped air hockey turntable earth Vivere diu rebellionus! Proud propagator of the "fire for warmth" myth |
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#292398 / #25 |
Life is just a bowl of cherries
Read my posts with the following stupid accent: Pleasant Living
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As least you can admit it, most hide from that particular atheist truth.
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The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience. -Albert Camus |
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